EDIT: See @AnimePhantasm comment below! My friend called the election board and they confirmed what @AnimePhantasm and @fmstrat commented! This was Virginia reusing last year’s envelopes.
OP I am an absentee voter in Blacksburg just next door. Shine a light on the blacked out part. I am 99% sure this is legit, they just crossed out the witness requirement. I can see the word witness under the sharpie in your picture. Virgina doesnt have to do that witness thing anymore. We did at the last general election, so I am guessing they just reused the same envelopes. You should call and ask your elections office before alerting the news. They are hardworking folks whose jobs are already 100 times harder then they used to be. Stirring up reports of election fraud where it isn’t happening makes us just as bad as them.
A lot of the virginia ballots were mailed out with the return envelopes already sealed up. I called the election office and they said to cut them open and just seal them back with tape 🤣
Edit: to all the folks concerned about my vote, thank you for your concern. I’m not too worried about it for several reasons. You can check online to see when your ballot is received and accepted, so I’ll be doing that. If it isn’t accepted in the next week or so I’ll definitely be making some calls. Worse comes to worse, I can always go to my polling place on the day and get a provisional ballot in case something happens to my mail-in. I live in a pretty blue area so I have some trust in the local offices here; they’ve given no reason for me to be suspicious. Nonetheless I’ll still be double checking.
This can happen if the envelopes get damp, but they should send you a replacement. Otherwise, someone could swap out your ballot and then just tape it closed.
Which is exactly why I called my local election office, and I even mentioned it might have been because of the rain we were having, but I was told no, it wasnt the damp that caused it because they had confirmed with the factory that sent the ballots out that some had been sent out like that. They then told me to tape it and when I was hesitant because I had the same thought as you they told me they had checked several times with the registrar that taping them up was what to do. They said it was a known issue so it would be accepted.
…what…
How can an election office accept envelopes that have been tampered with? Call them back and record the answer, then call local news, blast them on every social media you have, put a crazy persons handwritten sign in your window about it, whatever it takes. The person who said they would accept envelopes that had been cut and taped just admitted they will accept votes that may have been tampered with…
If the election results aren’t to their liking, these will be easy votes to start kicking out. And then the votes that are doubled through provisional voting, i.e., voting in person as well as mail-in in order to be sure your vote was counted.
It won’t matter if they’re counted correctly in the end. The point will be to immediately kill off democratic votes, create as much chaos as possible, declare victory, and when the dust settles, the republican, right-wing national network of fast-response staff, politicians, lawyers, and friendly judges that they’ve been preparing for four years while democrats did basically nothing will have effectively taken the election by force. SCOTUS already made a decision that will allow them to effectively decide this election. So the right-wing ideologues already have local, regional, state, and national plans that extend all the way to the highest court in the land.
And the Democrats have “but that’s not fair.”
it would be accepted.
Bullshit.
Same thing happened to me in Pennsylvania. Will be watching very carefully on the ballot status emails to make sure it’s still accepted.
I’d call your local TV station or newspaper. Let them investigate and publicize it, and if it’s all aboveboard at least it’ll be out in the open.
And the Republicans will scream about how democrats are using provisional ballots to vote twice. They’ll try to cast doubt on any non-favorable election result, and they’ll have the provisional votes as proof. The fact that it doesn’t mean the vote was counted twice will get lost in the noise, and it’ll be one more BS piece of “evidence” to cast the election as illegitimate.
I’m not saying you’re doing anything wrong, I think you’re doing the right thing. But we’re just in a very fucked up place politically right now.
If worse comes to worst*
cut it open and tape it back up
Don’t just call the election office, call the local news, get it trending.
It’s almost as if Republicans can’t win the popular vote and have to cheat or something (:
Just to be real, they really don’t care about the popular vote. They care about the electoral vote. And even that isn’t totally true. They care about the electoral victory. They long ago abandoned democracy; they don’t care about having democratically granted power. They just want the power.
A little felony by blacking out a mail-in ballot is literally the least they’re ready, willing, and able to do to win.
I continue to be incredibly frustrated by how little democrats have done to counter the fraud, voter suppression, constitutionally dubious laws, takeover of state election boards and volunteers, and armed, volunteer “ballot watchers” the Republicans have deployed.
The republican “ground game” that extends beyond simply GOTV efforts and campaigning and into the wide-ranging and widespread strategies and tactics to literally dismantle and inhibit the democratic process has been met with very little resistance by the democrats. Somehow they’re going to be blindsided by this, cry foul retroactively, and then be hamstrung trying to play defense from behind. Wilfully ignorant, short-sighted, and incredibly dangerous idiocy for something so fundamentally important.
The democrats don’t have to be unethical because the Republicans are, but they should have been being proactive and serious about countering these attacks on the democratic process. Instead the approach seems to be sticking their fingers firmly in their ears and going “lalalalala.”
and armed, volunteer “ballot watchers”
I’ll be there on election day. Take that as you will.
That just works against your own interests. The point is people patrolling around glaring at people is voter intimidation. You think people will recognize “oh, that guy is on our side”?
Even if that was the case, do you think knowing there are TWO armed groups that hate each other prowling around a voting location is less intimidating?
We get it, you have a gun. You’re not helping.
To be fair, if they’re Black, or have rainbow hair, and are glaring at the old white dudes wearing red, it would make me feel safer.
Yes, so much better to have covering fire when going into a church to vote.
and armed, volunteer “ballot watchers” I’ll be there on election day. Take that as you will.
Oh shit everybody, @shalafi@lemmy.world is gonna be there! We can all collectively sigh in relief now!
There’s a neat post I came across some time ago showing how few votes can still win the electoral college.
Turns out, though unlikely, it is possible to win the election with less than 25% of votes through the magic of the electoral college and disproportionate representation.
Yeah, clear cut election fraud.
Anyone want to take bets on it being a Republican behind this?
OP I am an absentee voter in Blacksburg just next door. Shine a light on the blacked out part. I am 99% sure this is legit, they just crossed out the witness requirement. I can see the word witness under the sharpie in your picture. Virgina doesnt have to do that witness thing anymore. We did at the last general election, so I am guessing they just reused the same envelopes. You should call and ask your elections office before alerting the news. They are hardworking folks whose jobs are already 100 times harder then they used to be. Stirring up reports of election fraud where it isn’t happening makes us just as bad as them.
Excellent point. I alerted my friend to your post. I don’t have the envelope, they just sent me the picture. They go to bed early but I’ll update you in the morning.
Thank you for the info! My friend called and you are correct. I edited the post to reflect this information!
Honestly that is scary to see. People are going to lose the chance to influence. A true potential for a stolen election.
Can someone explain this to a non US person please? You sign your votes?
For mail-ins, yeah, you sign it to do the final “I authorize this document to be my vote”.
If you don’t authorize it, it’s not legally your vote.
NY requires you to also sign the registration book when you vote in person.
There’s a difference, signing the book is done before you vote in person in ny, and is not associated with your ballot or who you voted for. So in person there’s no way to know who you voted for.
For mail-in, you don’t sign the ballot itself. You sign the envelope, which is used to validate / track who voted, but is then separated from the actual ballot before counting so there’s no way to track who you voted for.
The person who sent the ballot did this. The assholes that want to fuck with the election are actively trying to get these positions.
You sign the envelope that contains the ballot. That way, an election worker can compare the signature on the envelope to your signature on file.
This is how they make sure that someone didn’t steal the ballot from your mailbox and fill it out for you.
Once the signature is verified, the envelope is opened and the anonymous ballot inside is removed and stored with all the others. When they are counted, there will be no way to tell who filled out each ballot.
When I did absentee voting, the voter signature and voter id information were on a perforated slip attached to the outside of the envelope.
That way, the process is something like:
- Look at the slip. Verify voter signature, eligibility to vote, and mark as having voted in the voter rolls.
- Detach perforated slip from sealed envelope. Sealed envelope now contains no identifying information. (This envelope was mailed inside an outer mailing envelope.)
- Entire sealed envelope and contents thereof goes into big bin of accepted ballots.
- Later, election workers open the sealed envelopes from the bin and run the actual ballot papers through the scantron machine.
And yet the “scary machines” are too easy to tamper with… they are scared of them because of how hard it would be to get away with tampering with them. And they know their supporters and others in government don’t know any better and will jump on the bandwagon of the machines being vaguely scary.
As I understand it, a fairly bulletproof method is to vote using a machine that prints out a human readable card with a punch through the candidates you voted for. So you can confirm the machine understood the options you tapped and then drop the paper ballot into a secure box, which can be used as a backup for manual recounts.
Anybody know if this is what the experts [still] want?
Honestly, while it would certainly help sell it to less technical people. There is no need for a paper copy to make it impossible to get away with tampering with digital voting, building in safeguards entirely digitally is actually enough.
But yes, most commonly recommended option is to have the machines do a quick result, and then paper to verify.
Right on.
Found an article from four years ago that I must’ve read by the way - maybe you already know all about it:
Yeah, it can’t be done online, which is why the physical machines are the focus. They can be incredibly tamper resistant, but more importantly, impossible to get away with tampering with them.
For mail in balloting at least in my state you sign the return envelope NOT the ballot itself.
In order for a mail in ballot to be valid, the person must sign the envelope.
I’ve always had to sign my vote by mail ballot envelope in CA. They keep a signature on file from when you last registered to absentee (not vote at your polling place) vote and compare the two to see if someone else is trying to vote in your name.
Yep, we have the same system in the UK. In fact, the envelope looks almost exactly the same so they might even be printed by the same company.
You get two envelopes (one big, one small), a postal voting statement, and a ballot paper.
The actual ballot paper just has a list of options for you to put your X against; there’s no personally identifiable information on it. Once you’ve filled it out you seal it in the small envelope.
You then fill in the voting statement (it has your name and address on it so they can cross your name off as voted, and you sign it so they can check your signature matches the one on file) and both that and the sealed ballot go in the big envelope. That way your vote is still private because they check the vote is valid in one step and then add your ballot to a pile to be counted with the others in a second step, at which point it’s anonymous.
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/voting-and-elections/ways-vote/how-vote-post
Wrong. We don’t sign our ballots.
Stop talking.
I think we found the guy that’s blacking out the envelopes. 🤣
Thanks for informing me of the details.
I could be mistaken, but most places check your signature against the voter roll. If your signature doesn’t match, then they’ll ask for an ID. At least that’s how it was where I volunteered in 2020. This is done before you get your ballot. You don’t actually sign the ballot itself.
So somebody reported this to the State election board and told all the news agencies, right?
My friend reported it to the election board, but doesn’t want to report it to the news. I can’t make him and I don’t live in Virginia. If anyone wants to share this, my friend nor I will be opposed.
News tip submission forms for Roanoke, Virginia:
@UnpopularCrow, since you have more information about this than the rest of us, would you mind submitting the details to these news organizations?
This brought up a concern of mine that I had last year. I tried looking but couldn’t find it. Is there a way to verify that my vote was counted and specifically counted for whom I voted?
Edit: To clarify, my state does have voter history but only what elections I vote in, not how I voted.
Worst case scenario, someone intercepts my ballot and/or changes my vote. Website says “yep, you voted.” Great, but I want to know it was counted correctly.
Ultimately our whole voting system needs an overhaul, but I doubt that’ll happen anytime soon.
I don’t believe there is, and if there was, it could be used for some really nefarious purposes!
TBH idgaf who knows my vote history, I want the peace of mind that it was counted correctly.
I totally hear that, but at the same time it’s really important for a functioning democracy that the vote be secret. For one, it empowers a suppressed class to vote against their suppressor’s interests without fear of retaliation.
There is already a record of who voted for what, all of your fears could be taking place as things are now. Making it accessible to the person, even with hoops to jump through, would only be an improvement.
No, there’s not. There’s a record of who voted. There is a record of your political party in most states. There is no record of who you actually voted for.
The majority of votes in the USA are electronically counted, and a ballot itself is a record of a vote as well. What there isn’t is a searchable index of who voted for what, and I apologize for my unclear language.
But the likelihood of oppression based on availability of those vote records is still very much there even if the voter themself doesn’t have access.
Now THAT is some privilege lol
Plenty of places in the US where you risk personal danger if people know how you voted.
Then those individuals shouldn’t share how they voted, but I want the freedom to see how my vote was counted.
And they have the right to conceal their vote, as they should, but why should I not have the right to reveal mine even to myself, Necromancer?
That’s not how this started, moving the goalposts is pretty cheap. I was literally linking to an issue happening in this vary election that illustrates why secret ballots are so important. A position which, if you recall, you began by stating was invalid because you misunderstand (or, now more clearly, willfully misrepresent) how democracy in the US works, and your proposed “solution” only helps illustrate the easy ways vote buying and manipulation would be introduced without secret ballots. I’ll block you, for obvious reasons. Good luck
There is already a record of who voted for what, all of your fears could be taking place as things are now. Making it accessible to the person, even with hoops to jump through, would only be an improvement.
Edit: additional context for added relevance
Good luck loser
If you mailed in a ballot then there should be a way to confirm it was received, but there should NOT be a way to see who you voted for. Just like they can confirm that you voted in person, but again can not tell who you voted for when you showed up to vote.
Typically when you vote by mail you receive a ballot plus two envelopes. You fill out the ballot and put it in the inner envelope that should contain no markings as to whose ballot it belongs to. This is put inside the second envelope that should have your contact information (my state uses a barcode for this) and that you have to sign.
When the city/town clerk receives the ballot they look up your voter registration & confirm the signature on file matches the signature on the envelope. They then check off in their records that you voted by mail on that day. They take the inner envelope out of the outer envelope and add it to the other pile of envelopes they’ve received. At some later point they open those envelopes and count the ballots, but have no way of associating a given ballot back with the person who mailed it in.
If you then try to go vote in person on Election Day (or somebody tries to impersonate you) then their records will show you already voted and you won’t be allowed to vote again.
My county in Florida allows you to show your vote was counted. Damned if I don’t check every single time.
Florida here. How is it done?
Multiple counties have different ways, but here is a couple:
- https://www.browardvotes.gov/Voter-Information/Ballot-Status-Notifications
- https://www.votealachua.com/My-Registration-Status (registration status, but also tells you other things, including status)
My county in Washington state has a website where you can check the status. I even get text or email notifications for the status. “We received your ballot”, “the signature was verified”, “your vote has been counted”.
There was even a problem with my signature once and all I had to do was log in and verify it and it was counted.
My California county sends me a text and email.
So this is what a modern day “hanging chad” looks like. They’re really drawing on every previous election to insure there can be fraud claims.
America is going to have a rough one, no outcome will see legitimate - which is great for Putin regardless of whether he’s involved or not.
You might see if you can get this to the Meidas Touch guys too. They could help research and amplify this to the national media
Is this the year old thing where the witness signature requirements was removed, but it was still included in the instructions?
Curious about what was crossed out. We could probably tell with a better photo.
Let’s hope that mostly low information repube voters fall for this ballot tampering
They aren’t going to tamper with ballots in predominantly conservative areas. They’ll focus their efforts on more left leaning areas.
I am going to be voting in person. Hopefully Harris will win and when the Trumpers try to riot again the national guard is harsh.
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Get this paid spam out of here.
