Americans have tried to create third parties before, but due to the electoral college and the first past the post voting system, new parties are destined to fail and not win any votes. So the current two party system is the natural state of America.
The only way to change this is to get rid of the electoral college and the FPTP system, like that’s ever going to happen.
You can get a successful new party but only if one of the two big ones completely self-destructs and creates a power vacuum. And even then the new party will probably be a faction of the defunct one. There definitely won’t be a three-party constellation for more than a brief period.
First Past the Post doesn’t guarantee complete nationwide hegemony of two parties. There can be areas where the vote is between a mainstream party and a regional party, because the other mainstream party doesn’t show up. This happens in the UK all the time.
They don’t take a lot, but those seats are enough that the big parties often have to work with them to cobble together a majority.
Nor is First Past the Post the only factor. There’s plenty of southern states that have runoff voting. Their last century of state level offices are just as filled with Democrats and Republicans as anywhere else.
The US is unique in that not only are their only two real parties, but those two parties dominate at every level of government.
Canada also has a FPTP system and we have like 5 federal parties. But it’s also a Westminster parliamentary system that allows temporary alliances, minority governments, support and supply agreements and other power-sharing arrangements.
The American system is unique in their imperial presidency and aristocratic Senate and supreme Court, where so much power is concentrated in so few people for such a long time that every election becomes a high stakes cosmic event.
Well, the issue of the electoral college is something that I don’t fully understand, in the end from Europe I follow American politics relatively, but the English also have the first past the post system and they have more than one party.
Perhaps it would be necessary to start setting it up from more local elections or to the Congress/Senate, where a small but more mobilized mass could be relevant. With a relevant percentage representation in the chambers and/or state positions it could stop being crazy.
I don’t know, it’s an outside opinion, maybe it’s impossible, but if it is then American democracy is not only dysfunctional, it wouldn’t be a democracy at all, It would be a plutocracy with all the letters
I think it could work if the third party sets reasonable goals and steps to achieve a difference in America.
I like the idea of focusing on local elections, it could start out as a network of local communities that grows and grows, and when it becomes big enough for a national conversation, if it does, then we start on the federal politics.
We might find its not even necessary to continue on to federal government, as enough small communities change and it becomes the norm, the federal government will reflect that.
The electoral college is mainly for the president. Each state is “worth” x number of electoral votes (actual people who do the real voting, they just are supposed to follow the publics vote.) so running for president becomes a game of “how many points can I gather using various states to win” instead of “how can I appeal to as many people as possible to win.” It’s a clusterfuck and it leaves candidates ignoring states they think aren’t worth spending money and time in.
Well, if that only applies at the presidential level, a party can be created that competes at the legislative and state level. When it is established with enough power at that level, running at the presidential level might not be such a risky game.
Americans have tried to create third parties before, but due to the electoral college and the first past the post voting system, new parties are destined to fail and not win any votes. So the current two party system is the natural state of America.
The only way to change this is to get rid of the electoral college and the FPTP system, like that’s ever going to happen.
You can get a successful new party but only if one of the two big ones completely self-destructs and creates a power vacuum. And even then the new party will probably be a faction of the defunct one. There definitely won’t be a three-party constellation for more than a brief period.
Well the GOP is on its way, and if they reform into a moderately sensible party, the dems will have to move left to actually differentiate themselves.
I’m dreaming though.
The GOP is well on the way to creating a minority rule one party state.
First Past the Post doesn’t guarantee complete nationwide hegemony of two parties. There can be areas where the vote is between a mainstream party and a regional party, because the other mainstream party doesn’t show up. This happens in the UK all the time.
They don’t take a lot, but those seats are enough that the big parties often have to work with them to cobble together a majority.
Nor is First Past the Post the only factor. There’s plenty of southern states that have runoff voting. Their last century of state level offices are just as filled with Democrats and Republicans as anywhere else.
The US is unique in that not only are their only two real parties, but those two parties dominate at every level of government.
Canada also has a FPTP system and we have like 5 federal parties. But it’s also a Westminster parliamentary system that allows temporary alliances, minority governments, support and supply agreements and other power-sharing arrangements.
The American system is unique in their imperial presidency and aristocratic Senate and supreme Court, where so much power is concentrated in so few people for such a long time that every election becomes a high stakes cosmic event.
Canadians were promised electoral reform recently, what happened?
Well, the issue of the electoral college is something that I don’t fully understand, in the end from Europe I follow American politics relatively, but the English also have the first past the post system and they have more than one party.
Perhaps it would be necessary to start setting it up from more local elections or to the Congress/Senate, where a small but more mobilized mass could be relevant. With a relevant percentage representation in the chambers and/or state positions it could stop being crazy.
I don’t know, it’s an outside opinion, maybe it’s impossible, but if it is then American democracy is not only dysfunctional, it wouldn’t be a democracy at all, It would be a plutocracy with all the letters
I think it could work if the third party sets reasonable goals and steps to achieve a difference in America.
I like the idea of focusing on local elections, it could start out as a network of local communities that grows and grows, and when it becomes big enough for a national conversation, if it does, then we start on the federal politics.
We might find its not even necessary to continue on to federal government, as enough small communities change and it becomes the norm, the federal government will reflect that.
The electoral college is mainly for the president. Each state is “worth” x number of electoral votes (actual people who do the real voting, they just are supposed to follow the publics vote.) so running for president becomes a game of “how many points can I gather using various states to win” instead of “how can I appeal to as many people as possible to win.” It’s a clusterfuck and it leaves candidates ignoring states they think aren’t worth spending money and time in.
Well, if that only applies at the presidential level, a party can be created that competes at the legislative and state level. When it is established with enough power at that level, running at the presidential level might not be such a risky game.