I’ve been looking around for a scripting language that:

  • has a cli interpreter
  • is a “general purpose” language (yes, awk is touring complete but no way I’m using that except for manipulating text)
  • allows to write in a functional style (ie. it has functions like map, fold, etc and allows to pass functions around as arguments)
  • has a small disk footprint
  • has decent documentation (doesn’t need to be great: I can figure out most things, but I don’t want to have to look at the interpter source code to do so)
  • has a simple/straightforward setup (ideally, it should be a single executable that I can just copy to a remote system, use to run a script and then delete)

Do you know of something that would fit the bill?


Here’s a use case (the one I run into today, but this is a recurring thing for me).

For my homelab I need (well, want) to generate a luhn mod n check digit (it’s for my provisioning scripts to generate synchting device ids from their certificates).

I couldn’t find ready-made utilities for this and I might actually need might a variation of the “official” algorithm (IIUC syncthing had a bug in their initial implementation and decided to run with it).

I don’t have python (or even bash) available in all my systems, and so my goto language for script is usually sh (yes, posix sh), which in all honestly is quite frustrating for manipulating data.

  • bc3114@lemmy.ml
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    3 months ago

    luajit is small, fast(well, it can jit), and has a small but complete standard library and can do FFI pretty easily, should be ideal for most homelab usecase

    ldd $(which luajit)                                                                                
            linux-vdso.so.1 (0x00007ffee9dc7000)
            libm.so.6 => /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libm.so.6 (0x00007fb4db618000)
            libdl.so.2 => /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libdl.so.2 (0x00007fb4db613000)
            libgcc_s.so.1 => /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libgcc_s.so.1 (0x00007fb4db5f3000)
            libc.so.6 => /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6 (0x00007fb4db3ca000)
            /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 (0x00007fb4db799000)
    
  • atzanteol@sh.itjust.works
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    3 months ago

    I don’t have python (or even bash) available in all my systems, and so my goto language for script is usually sh (yes, posix sh), which in all honestly is quite frustrating for manipulating data.

    Why are you making it hard on yourself? apt/dnf install a language to use and use it.

  • mub@lemmy.ml
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    3 months ago

    I honestly love Powershell, but haven’t tried the Linux version yet. I only use Bash on linux but it has a load of odd quirks that make it unpleasant to use imo. Can’t comment on anything else.

    • tankplanker@lemmy.world
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      3 months ago

      I use powershell for work as I need the m365 modules for work and its very flexible with decent module availability to plug in all sorts.

      However it absolutely sucks for large data handling, anything over 10k rows is just horrendous, I typically work with a few million rows. You can make it work with using .Net to process it within your script but its something to be aware of. Being able to extend with .Net can be extremely useful.

  • cmhe@lemmy.world
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    3 months ago

    What about Lua/Luajit?

    In most scripting languages you have the interpreter binary and the (standard) libraries as separate files. But creating self-extracting executables, that clean up after themselves can easily be done by wrapping them in a shell script.

    IMO, if low dependencies and small size is really important, you could also just write your script in a low level compiled language (C, Rust, Zig, …), link it statically (e.g. with musl) and execute that.

    • slembcke@lemmy.ml
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      3 months ago

      I use Lua for this sort of thing. Not my favorite language, but it works well for it. Easy to build for any system in the last 20-30 years, and probably the next 20 too. The executable is small so you can just redistribute it or stick it in version control.

  • DigitalDilemma@lemmy.ml
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    3 months ago

    Perl is already installed on most linux machines and unless you start delving into module usage, you won’t need to install anything else.

    Python is more fashionable, but needs installing on the host and environments can get complicated. I don’t think it scales as well as Perl, if that’s a concern of yours.

  • nyan@sh.itjust.works
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    3 months ago

    Technically, you could bundle a Perl script with the interpreter on another system using pp and run the packed version on systems with no installed Perl, but at that point you might as well just use a compiled language.

  • GissaMittJobb@lemmy.ml
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    3 months ago

    I don’t know if it matches your desire for easy install of small disk space, but it might make up for it in other arenas - Ruby is my new-found love when making simple scripts. Being able to mostly emulate the shell integration that bash has by just using backticks to call a shell command is the killer feature in my book.

  • Penta@lemmy.world
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    3 months ago

    Maybe something like Elvish or Nushell could be worth a look. They have a lot of similarities to classic shells like bash, but an improved syntax and more powerful features. Basically something in between bash and Python. Not sure about disk footprint or general availability/portability though

  • Nibodhika@lemmy.world
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    3 months ago

    Realistically whatever problems you see in python will be there for any other language. Python is the most ubiquitously available thing after bash for a reason.

    Also you mentioned provisioning scripts, is that Ansible? If so python is already there, if you mean really just bash scripts I can tell you that does not scale well. Also if you already have some scriptsz what language are they on? Why not write the function there?

    Also you’re running syncthing on these machines, I don’t think python is larger than that (but I might be wrong).

    • gomp@lemmy.mlOP
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      3 months ago

      Also you mentioned provisioning scripts, is that Ansible? If so python is already there, if you mean really just bash scripts I can tell you that does not scale well. Also if you already have some scriptsz what language are they on? Why not write the function there??

      Currently it’s mostly nixos, plus a custom thing that generates preconfigured openwrt images that I then deploy manually. I have a mess of other vms and stuff, but I plan to phase out everything and migrate to nixos (except the openwrt stuff, since nixos doesn’t run on mips).

      I don’t really need to run this specific synchthing-ID script except on my PC (I do the provisioning from there), but I have written scripts that run on my router (using busybox sh) and I was wondering if there is a “goto” scripting that I can use everywhere.

  • undrivendev@lemmy.world
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    3 months ago

    Python.

    Just remember to use pyenv for interpreter installation, version and environment management. It’s pretty straightforward that way and you have predictability.

    Don’t ever manually fiddle with the system python and/or libraries or you’ll break your system. You should just rely on the package manager for that.

    • davel@lemmy.ml
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      3 months ago

      Neither of them seem to be a single file, and both seem to have several dependencies, at least that’s the case with the Homebrew versions.

  • Ramin Honary@lemmy.ml
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    3 months ago

    I would go with Guile, because it is built-in to the Guix Package Manager which is a really good general-purpose package manager.

    It ticks several of your boxes:

    • has a CLI interpreter
    • is a general purpose language, Scheme, amd compliant with revisions 5, 6, and 7 of the language standard
    • allows writing in a functional style (it is one of the original functional programming languages)
    • small disk footprint, but still large enough to be “batteries included”
    • decent documentation, especially if you use Emacs
    • simple setup: not so much, unless you are using Guix to begin with. The standard distribution ships with lots of pre-built bytecode files, you need an installer script to install everything.

    It also has pretty good libraries for system maintenance and reporting:

  • fubarx@lemmy.ml
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    3 months ago

    Tried bash, Make, and awk/sed. All hit brick walls. Finally landed on pyinvoke. Two dependencies to install on any new machine. Never had problems. Also, easy to debug and modify as projects evolve.

  • bruce965@lemmy.ml
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    3 months ago

    JavaScript through Node.js, or TypeScript through Deno if you like typed languages. They both check all your boxes (just check the size of the executables to make sure that it’s what you would consider “small footprint”).

    Both languages and runtimes are quite popular, so you will find any answers on StackOverflow.

    They are both single-executable with little dependencies, and Deno can also compile your scripts to self-contained executables.

    As a bonus, both support the vast and extensive NPM package repository where you can find all sort of libraries for even the most complex tasks.

    And they work with your favourite IDE or editor, not just syntax highlighting, but also contextual suggestions.

    • gomp@lemmy.mlOP
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      3 months ago

      Installing node uses some 60MB (according to zypper on my current desktop). I’d rather have something small and possibly that consists of a single executable.

      As a bonus, both support the vast and extensive NPM package repository

      That’s not necessarily a feature :) Package repos are great if you are a developer (I am one) working primarily with that language, but are frustrating if you just want to run things.

      • bruce965@lemmy.ml
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        3 months ago

        I thought so. Although almost nothing for modern standards, 60MB is not exactly tiny. Sorry about that.

        On a different note, a repository is always a good thing imho. If you’d rather not have to worry about the dependency-pull step you can always include the dependencies with your sources, or just limit your code to using features included in the standard library.