Obligatory reminder that when Polish envoy Jan Karski presented evidence of holocaust to British and US government and societal elites during his mission in 1942 and 1943 he was basically ignored.
Additional reminder that Hitler’s invasion of Europe was tolerated by the major powers riiiiight up until he invaded one of the “countries that actually matter”.
Additional additional reminder that the major powers initially PRAISED Hitler for killing all the communists.
But the meme is about the comparison of the same people looking back and looking at the present.
Let’s not pretend that the Nazis didn’t have a massive amount of support (and still does). Reminder that the vast majority of Germans at the time were in full support of the Holocaust in the same way that the vast majority of Israelis are in full support of the genocide in Palestine. Badmouthing the Holocaust in any of the Axis Powers countries would have been met with the same kind of backlash, and people in the Anglosphere just don’t want to admit that the societies we live in are the new Axis Powers and do in fact want the Palestinians exterminated the same way that Nazi Germany wanted the Jews exterminated.
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Let’s call it a cluster fuck that has been going on for 100s of years. And will continue well past your and my deaths.
Then. We. Should. Stop. Arming. Israel.
Because as it stands now, Western countries are not just complicit in genocide, they’re actively helping to perpetuate it. Your tax dollars are being used to exterminate an ethnic group. Mine too.
If we were to ACTUALLY call it a clusterfuck and walk away, that would be BETTER than what we’re doing right now.
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Israel was holding ~12k hostages held without charges or access to legal representation when Hamas took theirs on Oct 7, just after Israel had taken over al aqsa mosque on Oct 4.
Hamas tried to trade those hostages the very next day. Israel refused to trade any Palestinian hostages. So Hamas refuses too. If you’d be honest, you’d admit that Israel doesnt want those hostages back. They’d much rather have a new flimsy reason to blow innocent civilians up and steal their land. And what was Israel doing stealing Al Aqsa mosque on the 4th? was that just a peaceful thing you think? Not intended to stoke conflict, just minding their own business, is that your story?
“Let’s call it a cluster fuck that has been going on for 100s of years. And will continue well past your and my deaths.”
– You
By your own logic, we should let Israel deal with its own problems. Why does the West have to keep supplying them with weapons?
Also, Israel’s actions since Oct 7 have exceeded tenfold the depravity of Hamas’s crimes on that date so it’s interesting how selective your sympathy is. Getting kidnapped or killed by Hamas is horrible, obviously, but can the same not be said about getting carpet bombed by Israel?
USA went to war for 20years after 9/11
Yeah because that was such a successful thing and definitely didn’t make things worse for all involved. It also totally didn’t kill far more civilians in the Middle East than the 9/11 attacks killed civilians in the US.
Stop pretending that was some heroic thing and just admit that it was an act of revenge and collective punishment. Just like what Israel is doing right now.
Israel is founded on Settler-Colonialism of Palestine, it has a century long history in its current iteration. Just like the US genocide of indigenous peoples, Israelis are committing genocide against Palestinians and stealing their land. Equating them is to erase this very central fact, Israel cannot exist without genocide and Settler-Colonialism, while Palestine can. Trying to pretend there’s a deep, several century long history of the current fascist Israeli state is false.
Let’s call it a cluster fuck that has been going on for 100s of years
Lets not, because you’re flat out lying about that, bangcrash. 100 years. Not hundreds. In the ~800 years of the ottoman empire this wasnt happening, and that empire ended in November 1922.
Zionists like to lie about this history to make it seem like an intractable problem of ethnic hatred, but its self serving BS driven by 80 years of apartheid by Israel on the people living in that region, starting with the Zionist terrorism leading up to the Nakba.
The UN needs to admit they royally effed up in creating Israel back in 1948, and walk that back. Zionist terrorists have no right to be known as an israeli state in 1948, and no right to treat human beings in this manner from then until today. Israel needs to be disolved and the Israelis sent back to Russia and Europe where they came from. 80 years is enough. the ongoing injustice and genocide needs to end before the Israelis kill every non-jew in the region.
If the UN cannot or will not do that they are criminals themselves and should disolve in shame.
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The Nakba was murderous land theft, and 80 years of murderous apartheid and human rights violations cant be defended. The terrorism and mass murder is a daily occurrence, and yet you whine about “ethnic cleansing” like Israel is some sort of victim.
Restorative justice is possible, but the UN land plan was unjust and needs to be rescinded. I dont care if murderers and terrorists like it. GTFO.
liberals are against every genocide except the current one
damn bro, that’s bathroom-stall-at-hot-topic level profound.
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most of them at the mere mention of the genocide back in the us election season
Genocide is bad no matter who it happens to??
Genocide is bad no matter who does it??
Genocide is bad, full stop.
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I do not condemn the Gaza Palestinian prison break of October 7, 2023.
Palestinians have the legal right under UN law to struggle against their occupiers by any means necessary, including armed struggle, while Israel, as an occupier, has no right to “self defense.”
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism_as_settler_colonialism
- Philosophy prof. Hans-Georg Moeller: 📺 Guilt Pride: A German Vanity Project Conquering the World
Reporter: [REDACTED]
Reason: The guy is endorsing killing of civiliansWho do you think the reports go to, reporter?
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Condemn? I commend freedom fighters taking military action against settler colonial ethnocentric apartheid genociders.
Do you also condemn the ANC?
To clarify I only meant the attacks on civilians. There will never be a way to justify the senseless killing of those. There are other ways than violence to get rid of them. Ofc the whole situation in Gaza is fucked beyond comparison but there has to be another way on the world political stage to resolve this instead of letting it cook like we now do.
To clarify I only meant the attacks on civilians.
The ANC also attacked civilians. Though you should note how dramatically more the Israelis (and the SA government and white South Africans) target civilians.
There will never be a way to justify the senseless killing of those.
When under occupation, any means necessary is not only sanctioned by international law, it is necessary. Note that the kibbutzim in the area had armories and shot at the al Aqsa flood participants, which included a wide coalition as well as whoever simply went past the walls of their own volition.
How is it senseless, by the way? Do you actually know what happened on the ground? Who did what? What was going in in their heads? What their lives were? There is an implicit chauvinism in the use of clichés and guesses rather than become educated.
There are other ways than violence to get rid of them.
No there aren’t. You apparently know nothing about the history here, the many movements that attempted peaceful means, even as recent as the Great March of Return in 2018. And the repeated lies and violence that Palestinians have faced following every diplomatic agreement.
As you can see, the Israelis will speed up and openly embrace genocide at the mere perception that they are not totally dominant over those that they occupy. Israelis march not for peace or justice, but for harsher violence and getting rapists out of jail. They are an ethnic supremacist culture that embrace the genocide they are committing. You cannot “peace” your way out of that. You would condemn Palestinians to extinction.
For concentration camp victims, they are far more restrained than virtually anyone. Would you also condemn the Sioux for killing settlers occupying their land? Why not instead materially oppose the settler colonists? Your tut-tutting is just tacit both-sidesing of a decidedly imbalanced situation.
Ofc the whole situation in Gaza is fucked beyond comparison but there has to be another way on the world political stage to resolve this instead of letting it cook like we now do.
There is not. You have an unrealistic idea about how geopolitics and imperialist violence function. It is not like the movies or the 1 or 2 examples of allegedly nonviolent movements recuperated by capitalism. You’re not going to win just because you are right or empathetic. You will not convince your captors and child murderers with a good speech and some protests. Most of the states, i.e. the major sourcea of military power in the world, will not step in to help you unless it serves their self interest - and most capitalist countries see subverting themselves to the US and therefore Israel as in their self interest.
And when states or similar forces do step up, you get tacit genocide apologetic PR campaigns against them. Such as, “do you condemn Hamas?”
The historical and realistic source of liberation is organized armed struggle.
:)
Hamas has tried all other ways. They did a peaceful march in 2019 and Israel still massacred them.
Hamas killed very few civilians. Most of those killed were trained soldiers who would have now participated in the Gaza genocide
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A mob of oppressed genocided people attacking two soldiers who are genociding them? That sounds awesome and justified.
You are suffering from not seeing Israel as Nazis. Replace every instance of IDF you see with the word Nazi. Let me know if you still feel sorry for them.
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For an unsuccessful genocide Israel sure has expelled a lot of Palestinians from their land into a concentratration camp. And installed a Nazi regime on that stolen Palestinian land.
That Hasbara budget increase took effect quickly.
Won’t somebody please think of the settler-colonial stormtroopers!
Repeating myself: Palestinians have the legal right under UN law to struggle against their occupiers by any means necessary, including armed struggle, while Israel, as an occupier, has no right to “self defense.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism_as_settler_colonialism
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IDF soldiers aren’t civilians you fucking moron.
To clarify I only meant the attacks on civilians. There will never be a way to justify the senseless killing of those.
Getting all high and mighty about when Palestinians kill civilians while conveniently ignoring Israel’s actions (both after this event and in the decades that led to it) makes your argument extremely bad faith.
If we’re going by number of civilians killed by each side, then the Palestinians are very much in the right.
Also, define civilian. I wasn’t there, have no stake in either side, and obviously have no personal desire for anyone on either side to get harmed, but I can sort of underatand why the victims of a genocidal occupation might not exactly consider the occupiers who stole their land to be innocent civilians.
instead of letting it cook like we now do.
“Letting it cook” would be an improvement to what we’re currently doing, which is actively supporting and arming Israel.
I feel like this would be less strawmanny if the kid was saying “ethnic nationalism is evil” instead. Because while no one’s actually defending “genocide”, lots of people do defend zionism and the definition of zionism is basically white nationalism, but specific to jews.
The problem is that people have equated Israel to genocide to jewish people in general. So if you criticize the genocide the listener is free to imply you are critical of jewish people, therefore an antisemite.
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But, I will say that the Jews in Nazi Germany weren’t committing random acts of brutality against German civilians
Neither are the vast majority of Palestinians doing that to Israelis.
and had never officially pledged in writing to eradicate all the german
See above.
Your comment is not dissimilar from the “all Jews want to destroy the German race” bulllshit the Nazis spewed. Both are sweeping, malicious generalizations that aim to justify the oppression and collective punishment of entire ethnic groups.
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They were “elected” before most of the population in Gaza was even born.
The current genocidal Israeli leadership was also democratically elected, and very recently at that, and their approval rating has only increased. What does that say about the majority of Israelis? Why do they deserve your sympathy if the Palestinians don’t because of who they voted for?
but I also understand that it’s pretty difficult for someone who has lost people close to them to to differentiate between the Palestinians who killed their sister because she was a Jew and the ones who didn’t
Care to clarify this BTW?
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If you have a friend or family member killed by a paramilitary group that claims to directly represent a group of people you’d be pretty hostile to that group of people too.
Damn, you say this and yet you can’t even recognise that Gazans are human enough to have this also apply to then. Except it’s not “a family member or friend” it’s their entire family, and all their friends, and their home, and the city they lived in.
Fuck you, genocide supporting cunt.
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All of your blatant genocide support is what leads me to know that you support genocide. And guess what, during the Holocaust, you would also have been saying “it’s a conflict with too much history, I don’t support either side.”
Failing to support either side of a struggle supports the dominant side, which is undeniably genocidal Israel.
Does this logic not also apply to Hamas? Seems like it’s a pretty big part of why they’re so antisimetic then, what with Israel literally claiming to represent all Jewish people in the same way Hamas claims to represent all Palestinians.
Why the double standard then? If you condemn Hamas for its antisemitism, which I agree with, why are you excusing Israel’s anti-arabic actions if they’re based on the same fallacious logic?
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removed you were the one who started with the “Palestinians elected Hamas crap”. Nobody here has been attributing guilt to an entire nation’s population except you.
What a shock, a .worlder advocating for collective punishment and excusing genocide.
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You’re a genocide denier, the difference between that and genocide support is just the difference between an honest man and a lying shit stain like you.
And guess what, Israel is just like the Nazis.
In trying to point out an error, you make a far larger one: by failing to account for the very real quantitative and qualitative differences, you equate the two, and erase the real fact that Israel is commiting genocide in much the same way as the US does with indigenous Americans, to fuel settler-colonialism. The violence reflected by Palestinians towards Israelis has origin in the genocide perpetuated by the state of Israel. Regardless of the pain some settlers may be feeling for having this violence returned, the origin is from the settlers and the only way out for Palestinians has proven to be violence against their oppressors.
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Likely never, instead I will continue to side with and advocate for decolonization and land-back.
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Not necessarily, as Fanon puts it “The first will be last, and the last will be first.” This doesn’t mean every white person must be exterminated or sent back to Europe, it means Indigenous Peoples must be at the forefront and allowed to redraw national lines as they see fit. The same is advocated for by Palestinian groups seeking the One State Solution.
I think you’d do well to read decolonial theory like The Wretched of the Earth, especially as a European.
Blah blah, more lazy genocide apologia.
the only way out for Palestinians has proven to be violence against their oppressors.
Bullshit.
In an effort to acknowledge a continued commitment to the Palestinian cause on the part of the Saudi leadership, Saudi Arabia and the United States sought concessions from Israel on issues related to the Palestinians in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip. As the possibility of an imminent deal gained plausibility in August–September, the Palestinian Authority also became involved in discussions with Saudi Arabia and the United States in an effort to gain sway over the deal’s final shape. But concerns remained that the Palestinians’ grievances in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict would remain unresolved and that they would lose a key point of leverage if Saudi Arabia normalized ties with Israel. On October 7, Hamas orchestrated a devastating assault on Israel in part to disrupt the deal from taking place.
Wow, who would have guessed that a “peace deal” solidifying an alliance between pro-genocide states to cement the status quo of settler-colonialism would be opposed by the subjects of genocide for a century? Peace was already tried and yet it doesn’t work, Israel cannot continue its existence as a state without genocide and settler-colonialism of Palestine.
Israel cannot continue its existence as a state without genocide and settler-colonialism of Palestine.
So, if peace is not an option. What kind of resolution are you looking for then?
Victory to the National Liberation movements within Palestine and the dissolution of the fascist Israeli settler-colony, replaced by a single secular Palestinian State, the solution most recommended by the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine.
Get outta here with yer facts and history!
My 13 year old daughter was called a Nazi at school because she’s of Jewish descent. Not Israeli, Jewish.
But don’t let that stop your enjoyment of this strawman comic that pretends like anti semitism plays Zero part in the reaction
If that happened, huge if these days, that’s awful. Doesn’t excuse the genocide Israel is doing, doesn’t stop the fact Israel needs to be completely dismantled.
Every modern ethnostate so far has committed genocide. Ethnostates are bad.
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The argument isn’t “antisemitism doesn’t exist”. The argument is “criticism of Israel is not antisemitism”.
