Oh you’re that dipshit. Makes sense that you’re pearlclutching

That is a separate issue. I’m trying to understand what their specific health concerns are, why it is they feel any amount of vaping represents an antisocial immediate health hazard distinct from say driving while unhealthy, tired or whatever or taking drugs known to increase violent tendencies like alcohol.

There is something they feel is different and I’m trying to unpick what it is. Like is there a specific chemical they believe even trace vaping exceeds safe limits of? a class like VOCs but are they also afraid to be around a stove etc? Is it fear of lack of regulations meaning unknown contamination could be present? Is it lack of precedent of characterised harms? (e.g. standing next to a stove while cooking seems about as unhealthy as being near most* vapes but we tend to be comfortable with poorly ventilated stoves and not with vapes because stoves are boring).

They unfortunately seem to thing my curiosity represents some hostility, despite having stated that I am in favour of regulation and basically just have a couple of quibbles with this law ¯_(ツ)_/¯

I will could you answer my question about fog machines though?

For both of our convenience I would really appreciate it if you just listed the specific concerns you had in mind, along with a primary source.

If a primary source is too much because you believe something is “common knowledge” (e.g. asking for a primary source on why to look both ways before crossing the road is a bit pedantic) a relevant Wikipedia page about the immediate health concern would be fine.

Let’s exclude popcorn lung (diacetyl damage) for aforementioned reasons.

I’d also like to ask, are you concerned about fog machines which also make a vapour of vegetable glycerine? Or are your concerns limited to flavour compounds and trace nicotine exposure?

What is the immediate health effect of a nearby vaper? Like seriously I actually don’t know of any solid evidence. In it’s most basic formulation it is literally just a fog machine.

Oh but don’t they?

People who don’t do cardio might be more likely to have a heart attack while driving, or otherwise drive at a lower level of alertness (cardio improved cognitive performance and slows decline) hence increasing their chances of hitting someone.

Or perhaps they cost the state more in health (tbh probably like smokers they cost less but this is the common justification for the sin tax on smoking) which damages your ability to get your health issues attended too.

People drinking alcohol are more likely to engage in violence, and do actually pose a risk to people around them statistically.

Obvs this stuff is reaching, but so is most of the health stuff on vaping so far (most harm demonstrated is due to ‘popcorn lung’ which is basically a result of lack of regulation meaning a certain flavour got used despite this known side effect) and the point is we need to consider degrees.

We live in a society and there aren’t super clear boundaries on what we ought to be able to do. The current proposed law, which again I’m broadly in favour of, does massively fuck up by placing vapes under the TGA. That means they need to be regulated as medical devices which means unless you can show a vape has a medical reason to be on the market it wont be approved.

Since that will never happen (except, maybe as a cessation tool but the TGA will have high standards of evidence) this is still a ban on vaping, just the long way round. Note how CBD is legal and OTC except there are no approved CBD products for OTC.

One of the points in my waking up to carnism was when I mentioned an interest in hunting rabbits (a so called invasive pest here) over dinner with my family as a late teen.

My father expressed an incredible disgust at the idea of hunting, made some comment about sadists or something. The rest of my family were more reserved but similarly aghast, that I would be willing to participate in the process by which meat, which we were eating, was created represented some sort of character flaw.

Yet at the time we had gone fishing, and I had done work experience on a farm. I volunteered at the school farm and had raised broiler chickens and helped load them onto a truck to a slaughterhouse.

It made me realise how utterly disconnected we all were and how the people around me were utterly repulsed by the violence required for their pleasures.

I moved out shortly after and went pescatarian largely due to the soul searching that prompted. Becoming vegan later when I realised Nirvana lied to me.

isn’t it just? My favourite is “While 99% of all meat comes from factory farms, no one eats that meat.”

Not a single person I’ve ever spoken to about veganism, not at demonstrations or privately, has ever admitted to eating factory farmed meat.

Is it all some bizarre welfare system? the butchers/supermarkets/delies just buy it from the farmers and throw it out?

The problem is this applies equally well to stuff like eating fast food or not doing cardio 3x a week.

I’m an ex smoker for context, I hate this fucking shit but we don’t offer any real support to prevent addiction and just punish people for it.

I’m 100% plain packaging and selling behind counter (for all drugs, all products really ought to have advertising bans and plain packaging but I’ll never win that one). I’m also in favour of making addicting stuff boring. But after that people are ultimately free to make bad choices (I write, sprawled with terrible posture, a glass of wine, and some chips) and leaving the TGA to authorise these will mean none get approved and a black market will be created anyway.

I have legit lost sleep over the first quote from “they thought they were free” listed here:

https://www.facinghistory.org/sites/default/files/2023-04/Reading_Do_You_Take_the_Oath.pdf

You are literally spreading propaganda against climate protest.

Why? Do you want to discouraged protest? Do you want to distract from the environmental vandalism of oil companies? Do you want to empower governments to pass anti protest measures?

What is your goal here? If you are trying to recruit for an eco terrorist cell surely you’d do better psyching people up rather than ridiculing some of the most risk-comfortable protesters.

edit: You know I’m actually not done. They haven’t destroyed any paintings, they threw soup on glass. Unlike the fossil fuel industry which has destroyed like entire fucking species, in unknowable numbers.

Also you want to whinge about a blocked road but want people to destroy pipelines? what do you think happens when petrol stations can’t get fuel? Sure seems like that’ll stop even more people getting to work on time.

Could you uncritically absorb oil company astroturfing and pro status quo media bullshit a little less eagerly?

relevant usa civil rights quote applies:

First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can’t agree with your methods of direct action;” who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a “more convenient season.”

Shallow understanding from people of goodwill is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection."

Your armchair iamvertsmart take is counterproductive.

Nah this is just cope. Vegans come from all walks of life.

Ease of doing something or degree of missing it doesn’t really tip the moral scales much when compared to the yawning abyss of horror that is farming. Plenty of us loved all the hedonistic pleasures of carnism, just once you realise what you’re doing it’s completely indefensible and change is required.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vAamzBI8mI&t=4

Micrographs are awesome. My favourite is the tapeworm with false colour that looks like a methhead https://i.redd.it/97oiw37koff21.jpg

Also, unfortunately, it reminds me of this heinous thing: https://twitter.com/suzuya_96/status/1501884233656467459?lang=en

Right click the society, select open directory, locate the society.config file, right click and edit it. Set the variable there.

Do I have to spell everything out?

let LAND_PRIVATE_OWNERSHIP = False

Obviously… reactionaries these days aren’t even trying. smh my head.

Me approaching Foss developer with bug: Pardon me, if you could grace this lowly worm with but a moment of your attention; I with me a bug report, and I believe I have found the section of code responsible. This inadequate being lacks the technical expertise to fix it and would be eternally indebted if you would turn your monumental skills upon its trifling problems. It would please me immensely if my paltry efforts were of some assistance.

This user: SOFTWARE NO WORK FUCK YOU!